Most of header disappears + red triangle

[JeanneMarie]

I set up a template to serve as stationery. It has my letterhead in the p. 1 header and the header on later pages is blank. I typed a long letter and now I’m not sure what I did. I deleted a lot of stuff. Anyway, my multi-line header on P. 1 is cut off with a little red triangle.

The trouble is that I’m looking at the template and the document side-by-side and I can’t see how to fix this. I’ve reviewed the margins and the header settings and they are identical. But the letterhead is fine on the template and effectively gone in the document based on that template.

Help anybody? I’m desperate. I’ve been working for days on this and I was just getting ready to produce a PDF and send. I’d post an image but I can’t see how.

Using Libre Office 25.8.3.2 (x86_64)
Win 11

[EarnestAl]

There are different settings that might produce that result. Can you upload a sample of the template? Replace any identifiable text with some random words.

To upload a sample, click the 7th icon from the left with tooltip Upload

[robleyd]

Rather than an image which shows what you see but not what causes it, upload a Writer file that demonstrated the problem.

To upload an image or file, use the upward pointing arrow above whre you edit/write your post as shown in How to use the ASK site.

[ajlittoz]

A ref triangle means some contents could not be displayed within the limits of the “container”. The container here is the header. By default, a header “auto-sizes” to account for the volume of the header. But, you can force the header to a fixed height if your layout requires it.

Open the page style corresponding to the faulty header and go to the Header tab. Check if the AutoSize box is ticked or not.

You mention a “template”. Is it an .ott document (extension for a Writer technical template)? Or an ordinary .odt one you copy before modifying it for different contents?

[Wanderer]

@JeanneMarie

typed a long letter and now I’m not sure what I did

Just guessing, but I saw this once: The person had the cursor at the end of the header and started typing. Everything was appended to the header (and hidden, because of a fixed header).
.
Cure was simply to mark the text at the end of the header an move this to the right place via cut/paste.

[JeanneMarie]

Thank you all so much for trying to help. I kinda began to fear I might just have a corrupted file, so I relieved some of the immediate pressure last night by just creating a new file based on the same template and pasting the text. But this is not ideal. First I want to understand the problem. And second, I’d like to continue to maintain the same document with scores of tracked changes in it. I’m guessing I don’t need to tell you how complicated life gets when you try to keep two versions of anything in sync.

So I’ll try to hit all the points that all of you questioned:

The template was an *.ott file I accessed via FILE > TEMPLATES. I opened a new one, disguised the content, and saved it as faux-stationery.ott (attached). It’s based on something I’ve used for a long time.

I cannot disguise the info in the problem file because I cannot get into the header to edit it. See letterhead.jpg (attached). When I do click in the name at the top, I can use the delete button, but the subsequent lines of the letterhead (address, etc.) do not appear. Nothing appears.

If I don’t hit some limit, I’m attaching workfile-header_format.jpg and workfile-pg_format.jpg. Note that it’s not quite identical to the template. I slightly adjusted the page margins in the work file, but that was days ago. And again, I’ve used this format for years and have been working on this file for a week or so.

The letterhead is extremely flush right. I tried going into the work file and adjusting the right margin on the only line I can see or touch. That didn’t help and, anyway, as you can see, that’s fine in the template. I’ve used this formatting forever–tho not always in a template or even in a header. Still I’ve been editing this document based on this template for a week or more.

FYI:

• In the template and my work file, the placeholders are just manual. there are no fields except for the page numbers.
• The work file had 2-3 pages of images and I had deleted them; but I can’t say that the problem appeared right then.
• ACTUALLY, if I had to guess, it occurred when I exported a PDF. I’m confident enough about that to place a small wager. But I’ve done that before with earlier drafts of the same letter based on the same template.
• The work file contains scores of tracked changes. I tried making a copy and accepting all the changes and turned off that function. I saved the file and closed Writer. No change. I can delete my name, but I still can’t delete whatever else might be there (if anything) that I can’t see.

So why can’t I adjust the height of the header? or type in the header to solve a problem if there is one? Really, what good is the red arrow if I cannot fix the problem?

Many many thanks for any insights and/or advice.

faux-stationery.ott (64.8 KB)

[ajlittoz]

Structurally speaking, your template is correct.

My only criticism (not related to your problem) is the excessive presence of direct formatting (DF). In a template, you should have absolutely none, though DF may be acceptable on your placeholders. Nevertheless, your Body Text paragraphs should have none, even the “list” ones (use a dedicated paragraph style associated with a list style).

Vertical spacing should be incorporated to paragraph styles instead of doing so with empty paragraphs. Also Default Paragraph Style (DFS) is applied to “meaningful” text. I remind you that DFS is the master of all styles and is intended to store your preferred typographical and geometric preferences which are forwarded to all others. Consequently, don’t use it because you’d be tempted to tune it for its usage occurrences, forgetting that it also impacts other styles.

You should have created a dedicated frame style for the signature with adequate wrap properties to avoid the empty paragraphs to flow around the image.

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If you want *ad hoc* analysis, send me your document through private mail (size limit ~3MB if I remember right).

[JeanneMarie]

Oh, there is not much direct formatting in my document or template. In creating the faux template, I modified the header and then pasted a bunch of text from a web page. I didn’t even think about formatting that except to create a couple of bullets. My template and the work document only have direct formatting on single words or phrases (e.g., italic for emphasis).

However, I was not aware of the “rules” around the Default Para Style. I’ll have to study that further. Nor am I familiar with frame styles. In fact, I find styles one of the more vexing and frustrating aspects of Libre. I had truly mastered styles in Word but that is now quite a few years ago. I do not know how Word has evolved in recent years, nor have I really applied myself to systematically trying to master Libre’s styles. I have to try harder.

Thanks for directing my future studies.

[ajlittoz]

@JeanneMarie

I find styles one of the more vexing and frustrating aspects of Libre.

Styles are your best friends in Writer. They allow to separate contents from look. A fully style document with no direct formatting (except in the rare occasions where it is legitimate) can be completely reformatted reliably by only modifying styles without the need to chase formatting occurrences in text not the need to check text. Both the layout and the look can be changed dramatically (from stern academic paper to fluorescent psychedelic teen comic book alike) in a jiffie.

In addition, styles to contribute to minimal document size and lightspeed performance.

@JeanneMarie

My template and the work document only have direct formatting on single words or phrases (e.g., italic for emphasis).

Then use character styles (they don’t exist in Word and are therefore unfortunately disregarded). There is a built-in Emphasis style.

Using character styles allows to name e.g. italic with various “intents” and control the occurrences independently (without tracking them in text). For instance, italic may be used for emphasis, trade marks or foreign words. By assigning separate styles, you can change your mind about trademarks from italic to underline red without impacting emphasis.

@JeanneMarie

Nor am I familiar with frame styles.

They are the most difficult and “nasty” ones. They are associated with 2 notions newcomers are easily confused with: anchor and location. Once you understand the difference, you’re halfway through mastering them. Anchor defines the “object” (paragraph, character) the frame/image is attached to. The frame will always be set in the same page as the “object”. Location is either relative to the object (its vicinity as left, right, top, bottom or inside) or anywhere in the page (in margins or within page text area). So, a frame can be attached to a paragraph (and follows it through edits) but positioned at top of page, no matter where the paragraph begins within that page.

Keep frame styles for the end of your study of Writer.

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One thing I forgot in my previous comments about the paragraph styles in your header. It is a bad idea to offset the paragraph indents to send it into the margin and simultaneously to “fix” the position with a direct formatting directive. You should have fixed the paragraph style definition.

Even if I seem to always ramble on the same advice, avoid as much as you can direct formatting. It does not matter on a 1-page throw-away letter but if you have a long-maintained document growing to “unreasonable” size, styling is mandatory if you intend to tune or change your layout and formatting, not speaking of the performance advantage.