Bullet list entry indentation differs

English
#1

Version: 7.4.5.1 / LibreOffice Community
Build ID: 40(Build:1)
CPU threads: 2; OS: Linux 5.15; UI render: default; VCL: gtk3
Locale: en-US (en_US.utf8); UI: en-US
7.4.5-1
Calc: threaded

One bullet list in document uses (i) list style provided by Writer installer but customized by user (ii) customer paragraph style. List uses one list level.
Last (no idea of this fact matters here, however that one is affected) deviates in it indentation from remaining entries - as far as it concerns the visual presentation of list. Whole list entry line - inclusively bullet symbol - is indented other way.
For last list entry: contextual menu > Paragraph > Paragraph… > (i) Indent before text 0,60cm (ii) indent first line -0,30cm
For remaining list entries: contextual menu > Paragraph > Paragraph… > (i) Indent before text 0,60cm (ii) indent first line -0,40cm
Paragraph style definition: contextual menu > Paragraph > Paragraph… > (i) Indent before text 0,60cm (ii) indent first line -0,40cm

All entries use one and same list style.

It doesn’t help to reset direct formatting for last entry.
It also doesn’t help to reset direct formatting for remaining entries.

Which formatting area else could I check for possible reason of deviation?

#2

Always use styles for numbering. Be aware that the left indentation is controlled by the numbering style itself and not by the paragraph properties/styles.
For better working use linked numbering styles to paragraph styles. For generating a TOC use heading n style (if numbered apply only possibilities in menu Tools | chapter numbering).
HTH

EDIT

Chapter Numbering

Paragraph numbering

1 Like
#3

This doesn’t concern chapter numbering nor paragraph numbering. Just a list of bullets in one or few chapters.
I forgot to mention some entries are multi-line paragraphs, with intended entry paragraph formatting like hanging indents (the goal) - according to what me found it in Writer help > indenting paragraphs.

Thanks of input.
How to establish the link numbering style to paragraph style? In paragraph style definition window I find references merely to outline, list. I also find several stock paragraph styles named by string numbering X but no entry point to list of numbering styles.
As far as I see all predefined list styles whose names start with string “Numbering” are possibly for numbered list - which is not the form desired here.
How to make hanging indents in bullet list style?

Forgot to mention it is unordered list.

#4

One more question
How do predefined paragraph styles with naming scheme List X (…) differ from predefined paragraph styles with naming scheme Numbering X (…)?

Customer paragraph style used in list entries inherits from List paragraph style. When I take a look at one predefined paragraph style named by scheme Numbering I find style-specific indentation settings in same fields as I did it my customer paragraph style used in unordered list entries.

#5

As mentioned by @Grantler, in list items, left “boundary” formatting is completely taken over by the list style (whether implicit or not). Consequently, forget about left indent and first line indent in paragraph style.

Use a built-in list style like Bullet ⋅ (or some other), either by applying it manually to your items, or by associating it to some paragraph style. Then indent is tuned in the Position tab of the list style.

Built-in List n are intended for bullet list but not associated with any list style out-of-the -shelf. For this go to Outline & List tab and choose a list style from the drop-down menu in Apply List Style section.

Built-in Numbering n are intended for numbered list but, again, no list style has been associated in factory because you have the choice between alphabetical, Roman, standard, … numbering.

Remember also that both list paragraph style family inherit not only from List (handy to define defaults for your lists) but also from Text Body higher in the hierarchy. Thus, if you changed something in Text Body, it also propagates to the paragraph styles for lists.

#6

Thanks for input.

Use a built-in list style like Bullet ⋅ (or some other), either by applying it manually to your items, or by associating it to some paragraph style.

This is already fulfilled.

Then indent is tuned in the Position tab of the list style.

How to get hanging indent in list style? Compare to Writer help, Indenting Paragraphs.
Some bullet items are multi-line. All lines should on left side align to bullet first line text (bullet symbol and symbol to text deliminator excluded). How to achieve this?

Remember also that both list paragraph style family inherit not only from List (handy to define defaults for your lists) but also from Text Body higher in the hierarchy.

I such case I expect all entries of unordered list inherit equally while direct formatting is removed (which applies here)

#7

In the Position tab:

  • Aligned at: position of the bullet
  • make sure bullet is followed by Tab stop
  • set Tab stop at and Indent at* to the same value (of course larger than Aligned at)

These settings can be (are) different for each level.

#8

Thank you.

Aligned at: position of the bullet

Aligned at >>> only numeric values are accepted. No idea how to get bullet position in my knowledge - is it expressed also in numeric value? As for paragraph style in use it is set to 0cm however it was said here, as soon as list style is used the paragraph style loses its effect.

set Tab stop at and Indent at* to the same value (of course larger than Aligned a

Well, a trial to do so and >>> preview field shows results which don’t satisfy - list item second line aligns to so somewhere middle of bullet symbol one line above. In next step one click onto Apply > list in document doesn’t show any changes.
If, as next, to clear direct formatting (the last list item and remaining ones) hanging outline seems to be achieved as intended however last list item bullet symbol gets unique indentation/alignment (as it would be aligned to the right - while numbering alignment set to left in list style definition), all this while remaining parts of this list item aligned/indented as expected (how list looks like in document).

It is single-level unordered list.
One single paragraph style in use for all list items, same applies to list style.
I forgot to mention whole unordered list should additionally be indented on left by tiny-length blank space.

UPDATE
One more interesting test and results: all list items got reset/clearance of direct formatting. If to place now the cursor in list last item, then navigate to contextual menu > Paragraph > Indents & Spacing, the ‘before text’ and ‘first line’ fields show non-zero values. If to do the same for other list items these fields are set to zero. In order to fix the problem I had finally to create one more blank list item, then to copy and paste unformatted text from problematic item to slick new blank item. Finally remove old wrongly formatted list last item.
I have no idea why the goal could be achieved only this way. If I don’t get closed this gap in understanding I may run in future onto problems again.

Despite the fact desired tiny indentation from left for whole list is still not achieved.

#9

Attach a faulty sample file so that I have a look at it.

#10

Thank you for your offer.
As it is draft of scientific writing I am not sure if I can share complete document before it gets published. Maybe just excerpt of affected document fragment, however I don’t know how much information can get lost upon excerpting it.

#11

A half page with the problem is enough for me. What is important is I can see what kind of real formatting you did.

#12

How to proceed on excerpting in order no information you need gets lost?

#13

Make a copy of your original work. In this copy, delete material before and after the offending list. To make sure leave one paragraph before and one after.

#14

sample-Bullet list entry indentation differs.odt (33.5 KB)
Thank you for your engagement.

#15

Your last bullet entry has paragraph style List A which is associated with list style Bullet •. However, you overspecified an additional list style probably with a toolbar button (as shown by the Style Inspector). This direct formatting as always takes precedence over styles.

Such an addition can’t be cleared with Ctrl+M. You must manually toggle it off either by pressing the toolbar button or Shift+F12.

Direct formatting is the main cause of formatting glitches. It may look “intuitive” because we have been mentally conditioned by M$ Word workflow but it is definitely not our friend when we try to design a consistent and highly structured formatting.

#16

Thank you for your work and findings. Last time me used Word for writing this class is small number of decades back. That time I was happy to learn and use tools for clean/sustainable formatting.
It is Writer where due to lack of working ways in some cases I used direct formatting.
I will inspect document based on your input tomorrow.

#17

Customer paragraph style List A is linked to list style Bullet <bullet symbol> - Outline & List tab > Apply List Style > List Style, all that paragraph style definition dialog. Unordered list items got mentioned customer paragraph style assigned to. List items indentation formatting as defined in list style Bullet <bullet symbol> get presented in document view not until author assigns additionally that list style to list items. I wonder why the link in paragraph style definition is not effective.

To double check autor (in shown sequence)

  • conducts reset of paragraph style and list style assignment to list items by switching to respectively paragraph style “Text Body” and list style “no List”
  • saves changes to file
  • checks on list toolbar if no list type is active
  • subsequently she assigns paragraph style “List A” to all list items
  • yet subsequently assigns list style “Bullet <bullet symbol>” to all list items
    Only when whole sequence is carried out the list items have in document view indentation as set in used list style.
#18

As far as I know, only direct formatting makes style settings ineffective.

If your List A is effectively already associated with a list style, manually assigning another or same list style manually is over-specification (with direct formatting) and will perturb the list engine.

If your original document has ever been edited as .doc(x), it may be damaged as list and chapter numbering differ most between both suites. I’ve always had stability issues in this area when exchanging documents.

#19

Thank you for feedback.

If your original document has ever been edited as .doc(x)

It is the case! Once imported from .doc. Are any means to clean up known?

#20

If you’re ready to accept a full restyling, yes.

  1. create a new blank document
  2. configure all your styles (paragraph, character, page, list)
  3. save to have a reference and make a backup copy

Then open both your new document and the old one:

  1. select the whole old text, copy
  2. in the new document, Edit>Paste Special>Paste Unformatted Text
    This gets rid of all M$ Word “pollution”
  3. apply your styles to the raw new text

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