Discrepancy in Display of LibreOffice Documents

Hi everyone,

It seems that the files are being displayed differently on one of the company computers, as if the line and paragraph spacing is being displayed as larger than intended. This causes inconsistencies in the visual layout of the documents. FYI: we are using LibreOffice 7.0.6.2 on Ubuntu 16.04.

To illustrate the problem, I have attached a screenshot of the same document opened on two different computers where you can clearly see the distortion in the file caused by the spacing discrepancy.

Currently, we have found a temporary solution to this problem by manually adjusting the font size at the line spacing points. However, this has proven to be difficult, especially when multiple users are working on the same document. Differences in spacing make it difficult to maintain a consistent look across all computers, causing confusion and hindering the collaboration process.

I’d appreciate your help in identifying the cause of this spacing discrepancy and any steps we can take to resolve it permanently.

You didn’t tell how the documents are formatted. Do you use styles consistently? Are they stored in a template file over which all your documents are based? Are your users allowed to make formatting adjustments (which is usually done as direct formatting)? Are they taught to use styles and only styles?

If you can’t guarantee that the documents are binary exactly the same, there is no discrepancy to be diagnosed. And I’d bet there are many text boxes around (instead of text frames or other “well-integrated” structuring primitives).

Give as much information as possible about the basic design of the document (use of tables, frames or drawing objects).

Complex documents must be very methodically and rigorously structured otherwise the slightest difference in computer configuration results in the behaviour you complain about. For example, is any fancy font missing on the “faulty” computer? In this case a more “standard” font in the same family is substituted for the missing font.

We use the styles consistently, and the file in both screenshots is the identical version with the same timestamp - no one has overwritten anything in it. We keep these files as templates, where we only fill in the first page of the table (and no, too much content on the 1st page does not cause the rest of the document to misalign). We store the files on Dropbox, where everyone uses one shared account. We do not make any formatting changes to this file. Learning how to use styles is part of our training, and I don’t think it’s an issue here.

We all use the same hardware (same laptop model), have identical versions of all systems, and only use standard fonts in documents - others are installed on all devices, but I wouldn’t call them fancy. There are indeed tables and text boxes in the file. The table in the prev screenshot is not a graphic, but a spreadsheet-style table.

The problem really only lies in the pages I am about to attach in next reply. As you can see, they’re the only ones where the text doesn’t fit on one page. And, you can only find the table there. No graphics or text boxes (below what it looks like when properly displayed in .odt)

If I reduce the line spacing on these two pages, the spreadsheet reverts to the normal version - the one everyone else sees. In simpler files without text boxes and with styles applied, this problem can also occur.

You said you would attach files containing the problematic table and subsequent text (2 pages total), but I see only screenshots. Screenshots are worthless because they don’t allow the contents to be examined. So please attach this reduced version of your document.

If you consider the document to be confidential, send the 2 pages via private mail. Click on the icon next to my name: a pop-up appears with a “message button”.

In original screenshot, page two has different heading text.

Is Dropbox synchronising local files correctly on the computer that is different? Normally, if two people work on the same file at once in Dropbox, only one version is saved, the other, or maybe both, become conflicted copies. If one computer cannot synchronise it will carry on using the locally saved copy.

If it is a difference in Writer, you could check that the settings in Tools > Options > LibreOffice Writer > Compatibility are the same as other computers. Those settings will override the document settings, see this help for user-specific settings, General

Unfortunately, it tells me that I can’t send you a message. I am sending a complete document with some data made anonymous. It is possible that the document is displayed correctly on your computer, as it is on mine. Therefore, I have attached the pdf of the same document (no changes made) from the problematic computer (my colleague’s).

Let me know in case you need anything else.

2023mmdd_AniołyKariery_Oferta & Opis elementów_Imię i nazwisko.odt (614.9 KB)

2023mmdd_AniołyKariery_Oferta & Opis elementów_Imię i nazwisko.pdf (437.8 KB)

I don’t see it. Did you mean “Usługi dla Executives”? It’s not a headline, it’s text in a table without a border.

Yes, the synchronisation works fine. We do not overwrite the document, we just copy and paste the template into the appropriate folder and then change the first page. A conflicting copy thus is not the reason here.

Unfortunately, I’ve already checked this - we have the same settings.

Your document gets totally awry on my computer, mainly because I incur font substitution. But let’s look at the main issues.

Your document is not based on a template

In LO parlance, a template is a special type of document (with a specific extension, .ott for Writer) which magically transforms into a “standard” document (extension .odt for Writer) with all its contents kept when launched. After this initial step, you edit the document just like standard documents.


An added benefit of using a template is the automatic update when you change styles in the template. All documents based on this template are upgraded when you open them for edit.


I guess then that you provide some standard document as a model to be customised by your users.


This is not an error, but I want to clarify a vocabulary point.

Your document is nearly totally direct formatting

This is the biggest issue which becomes really apparent with my font substitution (I am under Linux and the original MS fonts are not installed – you’re under Ubuntu; why do you insist on Arial?).


You style paragraphs with xxx_Headline1 and xxx_Text but you immediately change attributes manually. For example, xxx_Headline1 is used for the document title in 100pt and also for intermediate headings in 13pt bold. You also use (or is it simply an automatic application due to context rules?) some built-in styles. But the overall impression is style inconsistencies since paragraph of similar importance/significance get styled differently.


You defined character styles but I did not spot their usage (I didn’t dig too deep to locate them). Most of enhancements/highlights are done manually despite the existence of these character styles.


All vertical spacing is done manually with empty paragraphs or page breaks. The latter usage questions the kind of document you’re writing. Is it a flow-oriented one where page boundaries don’t matter? By this I mean, you let Writer decide where to break pages so that it stuffs maximum contents in every page. Or is it some page-oriented document where you consider every page to expose a different topic and every topic is limited to a single page with a controlled layout? I mean text disposition is not linear, but you want to position items anywhere in this 2D space. Then you should look for a DTP program like Scribus. You can have a mid-term situation where your text flow is quasi-linear by forcing a page break in your www_Headline1 style which seems to indicate a transition in the discourse. You could also use Impress to build it as a collection of “slides”. With Impress, you’d partially solve the issue of “comment blocks”.


You use tabs and spaces to create indents and alignment. This should be done with paragraph style configuration.


All you lists are created with the toolbar button. This is acceptable for tiny documents but in such one, you should use list styles.

You mix text and frames

You inserted some of the tables as OLE objects (I understand it is easier to edit the data in Calc than in Writer) and they end up as frames. A frame is roughly a rectangle which removes available space for the discourse, i.e. text will avoid it. But you must tell Writer how this frame will interact with text. The main factors here are anchor and position.
<brAnchor tells when text and frame meet. So, you usually anchor a frame To paragraph so that the frame will move with the paragraph when you edit your text.

EDIT
Once you have anchored your object, you can position it. The anchoring element defines the page inside which insertion occurs. You can of course position the object in the vicinity of the anchor but you aren’t constrained to do so. If you choose a page reference, your object can be located anywhere.

It is important to understand the difference between anchor and position. To page anchor is not needed to set the object at top or inside a margin. To page is very special (DTP-like) and should be avoided until you fully understand all the consequences. In principle, in a flow-oriented document, To page is not relevant and is rather harmful.
END OF EDIT


Your table after " Zakres naszych usług" is anchored To page; it is not attached to a paragraph. It then becomes independent from text and will get out of sync after the slightest change to contents before the mentioned heading.


In the same page, you have inconsistent anchors in the oval-shaped text. It is made of 3 separate objects: an oval, a text box and a lamp image. Two of them are anchored To page (then I assume they will keep their position relative to the OLE object) but the lamp is anchored to some character in the heading. Therefore when the heading shifts, the OLE object, the oval and the text box remain where they are but the lamp accompanies the heading.


Advice: prepare such decoration in Draw so that it ends up as a single object in Writer. In addition, any shape in Draw can contain text. Thus you enter directly your text inside the oval, avoiding the need for an additional text box you have then to position over the oval.


The same goes for “Szczegółowy opis elementów …” which is anchored to some character in the heading. Additionally, you should not have used a text box but a text frame where all formatting features of Writer are available, notably styles.

Your problem here is you want to “decorate” an external object (=not text). You can’t anchor frames to other frames and you need the anchor to be at some precise position within the OLE object. This is only possible if you transform your OLE object into a Writer table. But I guess you consider this a tremendous work load.

Global analysis

I stopped after a few pages, not going into details because there are too many problems.


The main issue is the lack of styling despite some obvious attempt to it. Your document has a complex design structure. It can’t be handled with rudimentary methods like direct formatting. You must absolutely learn styles.


Direct formatting is responsible for the discrepancy you see. Your documents are not controlled consistently by styles. So, the slightest difference in configuration is enough to trigger huge differences. My wild guess is probably the lack of Arial on the problematic computer because Arial is not a native font in Linux distros.

Fix

The only fix I see is to rework completely your document(s) with a methodical, consistent and systematic approach. Also learn how to use templates (in the Writer meaning of the term).

Start by reading the documentation. If you want to progress quickly, I recommend Bruce Byfield’s book. I think you’re already beyond the Writer Guide level but it could be a good idea to reread it, at least the chapters on styles.

Be also aware that mixing frames (I use this word as generic for any inserted object) with text is an advanced art.

2 Likes

If I modify paragraph style CareerAngels_Text to use font OpenSans then I can reproduce the almost layout exactly. I think your colleague doesn’t have Arial installed, or has a damaged version and LibreOffice has made a substitute; OpenSans used to be the default font for OpenOffice once. Probably, Liberation Sans is not installed either because I would think the LibreOffice font substitution would use that in preference as it is very close, or identical, metrically to Arial

The other issue is also probably a font issue with the Lightbulb icon not appearing in the pdf either except when inspected in Draw where it is shown only if I change the white font colour to black

One reason for the large change in appearance is the OLE objects that are anchored To Page, forcing text, and page breaks, to flow past it on to the next page