New Printer Template Not Recognized By LO7.0.3 - HP BUG?

[doktoroblivion]

This is a re-write of my problem trying to create a new printer based envelope template that should be picked up by LibreOffice (see below for versions, etc.)

The problem is as follows. I have a new envelope that is currently not a choice in my printer, nor LibreOffice (LO), in my case LO 7.0.3. This should be supported according to the documentation and I have followed the below procedure to try and get it to work. My page style in LO that I am using is provided below, updated for the new envelope size by me.

1. I define a new printer based template based on the instructions provided by my printer manufactorer (Create custom paper sizes Windows| HP Customer Support)
   
   
2. You would think if LO was correctly reading the acceptable printer paper sizes and loading them, then it would be an option when inserting a new envelope, but it’s not, it comes up with User Defined. Assuming that this is correct, even though other paper styles appear to me to be slightly spelled differently than the ones I see in the printer driver, I accept this and continue.
   
   
   
   
   
3. In LO, open my document, change current printer settings to pick up the new template paper size using current documentation, File>Printer Settings...|Properties|Paper Quality|Paper Sizes
   
   
4. Try to print the new envelope in LO using the template. Using Ctrl-P or other Print Envelope controls, try to print the envelope, but the template is never recognized, all you get is User-Defined Paper Size, this is a BUG.
   
   
5. If you continue and actually try to print the document, expecting some miracle, the printer rejects the paper size as a mismatch and ejects a blank envelope!
   
   

I am running:

• Win10, v2H20, build 19042.685
• LO v7.0.3 (build git log)

[Hrbrgr]

• Have you tried restarting: LibreOffice, PC, printer?
• Have you looked in your printer manual what the minimum paper size must be?

[doktoroblivion]

@Hrbrgr It’s not the printer, even LO7.0.3 recognizes the new printer template in File->Printer Settings, but it is never a choice when I try to print, nor is it recognized as what I set my printer settings to (if that makes any sense, I guess I do not understand how one part of the application can recognize the new envelope template, but when you actually try to print it has no knowledge of the new template? This must have something to do with the difference between printer Paper Options/Paper Sizes and LO Page Layout/Paper Size, but I am not sure how or if they are even tied closely together, they appear to be by name but not in practice, very confusing!)

[EarnestAl]

In my experience the sizes offered in the print dialog seem to be determined by the printer. As users, not developers, we cannot know when or how the sizes are loaded except by observation.

@Hrbrgr raises a good point about paper size, A7 is too small for my printer. If the size is not printable maybe the printer driver doesn’t pass the size to the dialog. I see from your manual that you have to find the allowed printable sizes from the driver; they are not listed in specifications.

Can you select your defined size in the printer properties from the button just below printer selection?

In Tools > Options > LibreOffice > Print there is a tick box, something to do with getting print size from printer tray (away from computer at moment), does enabling or disabling that make a difference?

[doktoroblivion]

@EarnestAl, @Hrbrgr, updating the forum append above with images of both the Tools>Options>LibreOffice>Print and Tools>Options>Writer>Print dialogs. Not sure anything there jumps out at me, other than the Paper tray from printer settings.

[EarnestAl]

OK. Paper tray from printer settings must be what I was thinking of, not quite the thing.

[doktoroblivion]

I am going to re-write the post above to show the scenario, I thought I was supposed to use, in order to get this to work, in detail.

[doktoroblivion]

Before I go on this issue, has anyone ever successfully loaded a new envelope paper size template into a HP printer? It’s just software and I would have hoped that somewhere there is an actual process, other than everything just being recognized as Custom, which appears to always default to normal paper orientation, instead of envelope.

I guess I have to consider this a BUG within HP’s paper size template model or design. It is frustrating for sure!

[EarnestAl]

Looks fine to use the User Defined setting 7.25 x 5.25, just change the orientation to Landscape.

[doktoroblivion]

@EarnestAl, you would think, but it does not work, the printer rejects it, giving the above message which is in the main post and just ejects a blank sheet of paper.

[doktoroblivion]

Okay, I can get this to work if I install the paper in the orientation that one would consider anti-envelope, that is, portrait. However, you would think if you have followed all the documentation and set up the paper sizes correctly, duplicating existing envelope formats and then modifying them, you would think you would load the paper as you do for other envelopes, but that DOES NOT WORK (IT’S A BUG)! If it worked correctly, as for other envelopes, the envelope would be at a 90 degree turn and this would automatically get recognized by the printer driver,etc., and would print accordingly.

The problem I see as it works now is, envelopes loaded flap first get mangled way too often, because the printer’s take up reel to load them spins on the opening flap and pulls it in making it load and print incorrectly. This is WHY HP put envelopes at 90 degree orientation from the flap, so that these errors would not occur.

I am flagging this as answered, but in my opinion a BUG.

[ajlittoz]

You’re right in pointing out the loading (feeding) issue. See how I proceed in my answer.

[doktoroblivion]

@ajlittoz, I read your answer below, but will only say that I think that is not what is suggested by the documentation by HP and LO. I think (IMHO) that I used the correct procedure, but the results that I got was not what should be expected, as per your own admission above. Aside from this, I was able to print all the envelopes correctly and LO and my HP printer did not complain after I made the orientation in the paper bay of the printer.

I am thinking this bug lies somewhere between the Windows Printer Driver template and the actual printer, since the printer does not actually recognize it as an evelope, rather a customer paper size. I think this is curious since there is no way of knowing what properties within the envelope template in windows dictates to the printer what is and is-not an envelope, and hence require a 90 degree orientation change.

[EarnestAl]

If I look at all the existing paper sizes in the HP print driver, they have the short length as width regardless of whether they are sheets of paper or envelopes. It seems that the HP instructions might be deficient if they don’t explicitly tell you to create your user size in the same format. So no bug.

[ajlittoz]

When I print envelopes, I make a distinction between the envelope size and the printer tray size. See below. I think the flaw in your design is to create a new paper size for the printer.

The printer is a “fixed” mechanical device. It accepts only a limited set of trays (unless it has a “universal” tray with sliders) capable of pre-determined sheet sizes.

What you call a printer template is a software configuration for the driver. When you send the print command, your present document virtual size is compared to the mechanical sizes of the physical printer. If they don’t match, job is rejected.

Instead of creating an instance of the printer, I’d recommend you create a standard .ott document template with a supported paper size. Design your envelope within this sheet, probably in landscape, enlarging the margins to leave only the address/sender area accessible.

The difficult part is to estimate the needed width of the margins. They must be set so that when the envelope is in the tray, either flushed to one side or centred and secured by sliders, printing occurs where it should. To test, draw the envelope contour on a standard sheet and make trials until everything fits in place.

Create also paragraph styles for the various logical parts: sender, recipient, address, postal information (ZIP code et al.), … Thus you’ll only need to style the parts and they will align to where they should.

To show the community your question has been answered, click the ✓ next to the correct answer, and “upvote” by clicking on the ^ arrow of any helpful answers. These are the mechanisms for communicating the quality of the Q&A on this site. Thanks!

In case you need clarification, edit your question (not an answer which is reserved for solutions) or comment the relevant answer.

[doktoroblivion]

I am not sure I agree with this approach, since the documented one seems to work with the exception of the paper orientation in the paper tray being wrong or unexpectedly different from any other envelope. Again, once I modify this, the envelopes print fine, albeit there may be occasions where one might get chewed up or mangled. Luckily, because I am using heavier envelope stock, this did not happen in my case.

Thanks for your input though, much appreciated…!

[ajlittoz]

I have several trays in my printer. One is in principle dedicated to envelopes with centering sliders. Unfortunately, this goes into the manual feed mechanism and the loading path is somewhat contorted inside to flip the sheet. Envelopes have double paper layers and they sometimes skid over one another leading to feed default. I now prefer to use the “standard” A4 tray with a single slider guide. This is more reliable because there is no sheet flip.

But the envelopes are aligned differently. Therefore the sender/address area is at a different location. This is why I designed separate document templates with paragraph styles. Provided I select the right template, everything goes fine and I print “A4 sheets”, fooling the printer.

[doktoroblivion]

Thanks, that’s good know!