Page numbers - offset not working

English
#1

LibreOffice Writer 7.3.7.2 on Linux Mint.

I have a 12 page document and I wish to insert page numbers in the footer, offset by 6.

This works up to the sixth page (i.e. page numbers 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12).

However, from the next page onwards it doesn’t work. I click in the footer, click Insert → Page number. The page number appears e.g. ‘7’ on the seventh page. But when I then click on it, put Offset 6 in the dialogue window and click ‘OK’ the page number disappears.

Secondly, when I save and re-open the document, the page numbers on the first to sixth page have not been remembered.

Help appreciated, many thanks.

#2

Page offsets are not what you think.

They don’t modify the page number. When you insert a page number field, you request an indirect reference: you ask first to retrieve a page, then extract this page number.

Using an offset of 0, you look for the current page and get its number. This is what most people expect.

Using an offset of 6 as you describe, you request the sixth page beyond the current one. On the first page, you reference the (1+6)th page and you get 7 because this is the number of the seventh page. On page 7, you reference page (7+6), i.e. the 13th page. Oops! It does not exist. Writer returns “void” which is correct because a non-existent page has no number.

Offsets are used in a similar manner as “see next page” or “see previous page”. There are not fit to “number” pages.

What you want is to configure the page style applied to this “part” of your book to start on a specific number. This is done with a “special” page break: Insert>More Breaks>Manual Break.

In the dialog which pops up, select explicitly the page style to enable after the break (probably Default Page Style) and enter the starting page number.

This will persist across sessions if your document is saved .odt.

2 Likes
#3

Note that it is also described in the help for the dialog that allows you to define that offset.

#4

:+1: :+1: :+1: :+1: :+1: :pray: :pray: :pray: :pray: :pray:

#5

Thank you, I see. But I don’t really understand the bit about inserting the manual page break. My numbering should start on the first page with the number 7. How can there be a page break before the first page?

#6

The manual page break is necessary to access the dialog where you can set the starting page number. But be reassured: such an initial page break which does not make sense if nothing precedes it, does not produce a real page break. In other words, you have no initial blank page.

Put you cursor at the very start of the document. Insert the “special” page break. You’re done.

Of course, a page break anywhere else will have the usual effect of starting a new page.

#7

I just tried it. It did produce a real page break! Then when I delete that page with a backspace, of course my page numbers disappear again.

#8

You’re right: this is a manual insertion and Writer never (or nearly never) removes anything added by user.
What is your skill level with styles?
Is there any specificity at start of your document? Something like a heading, like a chapter heading with a specific paragraph style; when such a paragraph with the same significance occurs somewhere else, should it also start at top of page? Then this can be fixed without the initial blank page.

Think about the abstract “semantic” properties of the first paragraph and describe its role to me. The solution is then either a customisation of a built-in paragraph style or the creation of a new paragraph style.

#9

Skill level with styles? I wouldn’t really know how to assess that. I can manage page styles and paragraph styles. I have absolutely no idea about frame styles.

My document starts with a chapter heading (heading 1 style) and proceeds with my “body text” paragraph style. There will be no other “heading 1” in this document. This is because it constitutes one chapter of a book and I am keeping the chapters as separate documents. I will later export them as PDFs before putting them together. I should mention that there are images in the document, but not on the first page.

#10

Then this is an easy path: modify Text Flow tab in Heading 1. Force a page break to your page style with starting page number. When the page break is forced through a paragraph style, there is no spurious blank page at start of document.

There may be an even easier way. I assume that all your separate documents will have a distinct starting page number, just following the last page number of the previous chapter. Instead of taking pain to enter manually the page number (with a high possibility of error when a preceding chapter is modified), create a master document for the cover, TOC and other tables (e.g. alphabetical index or list of figures) with links to sub-documents (your existing chapters). The master document will take care of the page number continuous sequence without the need to force anything in the subs.

#11

OK. I open up “Manage styles”. I put the cursor at the beginning of my heading (Heading 1 style). I right click on “Heading 1” and then click “Modify”. I go to the Text Flow tab and on ·Breaks" I check “Insert”, set “Type” to “Page” and “Position” to “Before”. I check “With page style” and put in the page I am using. I check “Page number” and set it to “7”. I click “Apply” then “OK”.

But then when I insert page number in the footer it is ‘0’.

Why oh why cannot Libreoffice make things easy?!

#12

Attach a sample file.

Writer offers a very consistent model. And everything is easy in this model because it is rigorous. Forget what you think you know about document processing and read the Writer Guide. It will not describe the model but at least you’ll have the basics for driving Writer. Don’t object Writer control is not “intuitive”; intuition is nothing else than conditioned habits. When you face something different, it hurts your routine but this does not prove it is wrong. You need to switch to another routine first and then only suggest improvements.

#13

With respect, I am not objecting that Writer is not intuitive, I am objecting that it is complicated. One demonstration among several is the difficulty in performing this task despite following the instructions received so far from an expert. It is years since I used Word, I think I am well deconditioned. This task (page numbering) should be simple, but quite evidently it isn’t! Please consider this.

I am very grateful for your help notwithstanding. Document attached.

EDITED: Document removed as no longer needed.

#14

However, I have solved the problem. The way to go was via Format Paragraph rather than Modify Heading 1. Then Text Flow, Breaks, and as described above.

#15

Thank you for your help.

#16

If the solution went this way, this means you had already some Text Flow direct formatting which masked your patch to Heading 1. Consider very deeply that direct formatting which, when overused, is an inheritance from Word workflow, willalways play nasty tricks on your back, as illustrated here. Direct formatting should be reserved for exceptional circumstances where you can’t do otherwise.

The precedence rule in Writer is: paragraph styles, overridden by character styles, overridden by direct formatting. Not understanding this precedence rule makes things difficult. And the situation is complicated by the provision of zillions parameters to format and layout your work, giving so many chances to multi-form direct formatting.

I encourage you to hunt for direct formatting presence in your document and to eliminate it.

#17

Thanks for the tip. Appreciate it.

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