TOC Not reflecting page number offset

[Thorne]

All right, I’ve seen the post asking something similar, telling us NOT to use the offset (why does it exist then? ‘If not friend, why friend-shaped?’). Instead to format title page, then add TOC then start writing and it should magically do it’s thing. What am I doing wrong, then? I format-title page, told it there are 5 of them, (it now calls them ‘first page’) then proceeded. but it doesn’t do the page numbers correctly.

Here is the truncated file. (for the record, my main doc body only uses Odd Chapter, Even Chapter, End of Chapter Blank, Blank Page and now Index and First Page for my page styles.

Google Drive: Sign-in

Hopefully this is the right link

[mikekaganski]

@Thorne

telling us NOT to use the offset (why does it exist then? ‘If not friend, why friend-shaped?’).

It tells to not use offset for what it’s not intended - i.e., for defining a page number (because it’s intended for something else - for referencing another pace from current).

And no, they don’t tell that something is “magical”. If you need to number your page in a non-default way, you still need to do that - just not with a wrong tool. You would need to set the page’s first paragraph property to set the wanted number.

[Thorne]

Ok, I’m a writer, so… I used artful words. I KNOW its not ‘magic’.

Please explain first paragraph property more fully

[Grantler]

@Thorne

Please explain first paragraph property more fully

Have a little search on this website and you will find (e. g.):

How to let a paragraph begin on the next page?

In order to allow changes in the document I want paragraphs to start in a fresh page automatically. I can’t find any setting for this. Where do I look? ton

Another way to inform yourself: libreoffice page paragraph - Google Suche


See also: https://help.libreoffice.org/latest/en-US/text/swriter/guide/pagenumbers.html?DbPAR=WRITER#bm_id5918759
For any further details don’t hesitate and ask here on this site.

[ajlittoz]

Page offset is a tool to reference a page, not to number it. Its main usage is related to “see next page” or “see previous page” (next or previous distance can be more than ±1).

Page number is one of the properties of page style. A page style applies to a sequence of consecutive pages. The page style defines how the pages are numbered (none, numeric, alphabetical, …) and the starting page number

So your question boils down to “how do I create and use page styles?”.

In your case, you’ll need three page styles: one for the cover page (built-in First Page is a good choice), one for the TOC (to be created) and one for your main text (built-in Default Page Style is intended for that).

The switch between page styles is done with a special page break Insert>More Breaks>Manual Break where you designate the page style to activate and the new starting page number. This same “special” break can also be provided by a Text Flow setting in a paragraph style configuration when you know that the corresponding paragraphs always require a break before them. This is usually the case of Heading 1 paragraphs at start of chapters.

All this is explained in the freely downloadable Writer Guide.

[Thorne]

You haven’t actually told me anything new, except about offsets. I have no idea what you’re talking about there. It’s always (in Word) been to compensate for the pre-numbered pages.

I do not see anywhere in my page style (in any of the tabs) that applies to the page number which is a field. You edit the field when you insert it, and use the offset to compensate for the shift. Perhaps, you should rather explain TOCs more in depth, as I HAVE read the guide and clearly have not made enough sense of it.

[EarnestAl]

Your file is protected from access. To share it on this site, you could drag it from a file manager on to a comment or question that is opened for editing or click the icon, 7th from left, with tooltip Upload to navigate to and upload here.
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To change the page number, you can insert a manual break and set the starting page number in the dialogue. This can also be done in the relevant Heading n paragraph style. To differentiate the change, you normally change the page style so the page numbering might have roman numerals for the front matter and Arabic numbering for the main body.
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Click Insert > More breaks > Manual break. In the dialogue select Page break, the Page Style for the next part of the book, tick the box Change page number and enter the starting page number (1 is filled by default)

ChangePageNumber113527.odt (51.8 KB)

[ajlittoz]

@Thorne

I do not see anywhere in my page style (in any of the tabs) that applies to the page number

Right. I answered too quickly. The starting page number is set in the “special” break. I edited my comment.

@Thorne

You haven’t actually told me anything new, except about offsets.

A page has an “intrinsic” page number assigned when it is created (i.e. when text requires a new page after the current page is filled). This page number is the next sequential number. You can’t modify this incrementation rule. Your only way is to break incrementation with a “special” break where you force the page number after the break.

You can do this without changing the page style (in fact, you specify the same page style).

Offsets enter in play when you want to reference a page, but this is tricky and quite “dangerous”. Your reference is usually linked to an “object” like a heading, bookmark, reference or image, etc. The reference is located in a page. You can then request another page relative to this reference: this is the offset (0 for no change, +1 for next page, -1 for previous page, …). You land then on another page from which you extract the “intrinsic” number.

When the offset page exists you see no difference with the forced starting number feature. But, when you’re near the “ends” of a page sequence, the final offset page may not exist, e.g. you’re on the last page and you asked for offset +1. There is no such page and the number returned is blank!

Regarding TOC, the engine captures the heading page number with an offset of 0 (page on which the heading occurs). The TOC displays the “intrinsic” page number.

When you insert a page number, you do this with a field. The page number field is very general, used in many contexts. Writer does not know what you have in mind (do you want to simply number a page with its “intrinsic” number or are your referencing another page to “quote” its number?) and has no reason to restrain the expressive power of the field.

Offset is not a compensation for pages to be ignored. Writer is more feature-complete than Word. Its model is based on a well-designed abstraction (perfectible probably, but much better than the one in Word).

[Thorne]

ok, so I’ve done the change starting number thing when making the manual break. But it doesn’t carry on after that. When I get to the next chapter, it doesn’t auto-continue from the previous page, I have page breaks after certain chapters (mostly they’re blanks for an image so that all chapters begin on the left page and I don’t have blank pages on the right.) which have no page number on them. But when the next chapter starts, even telling it to start one after the previous page, it does something funky. (I told it to start with 11 and it started on 7)
My style pattern is Odd Chapter, Even Chapter, with the occasional Blank in between

[ajlittoz]

There is probably something misconfigured. Attach your document to discuss your specific case. If you consider your document private, attach it to a private message. Click on the icon left of my name. You’ll get a Message button and press it to open a message editor.