Two pages in a book - two different languages, side by side?

Dear all,

I am attempting to format a book. It is in two languages and it would be great if they could be side by side.

I fail to understand how I can prepare a template that would allow me to just copy and paste the text afterwards.

I understand I will need page styles and have the two already prepared: the same settings are copied, just made into two styles so the text can be copied from one language and then from the other language.

However, I am uncertain as to how I can copy the text from the two documents - the writing/editing and translation were done in different documents - and get them to be pasted into the correct style.

having spent half an hour on searching, I am writing this because someone may have an idea or at least tell me I have to do this manually.

Much love! God bless!
D.

P.S. is there a way of changing the font in all the styles at once?

The main difficulty in a document for text+translation is the requirement for two parallel text streams: one for the original language, one for the translation.

The most stringent constraint is parallel, i.e. when you consider pages, they alternate between the streams. There is presently no solution in Writer for this. When you reach bottom of page, a new page is allocated for the current stream. Thus you can’t automatically lay out two alternating parallel streams.

A second constraint is the necessity to have “synchronisation points” between the streams so that corresponding texts are not too far apart. These “sync points” can be paragraphs (assuming both languages have the same semantics for what they call a “paragraph”), or headings if they occur very frequently. Other possibilities can be considered.

Some may suggest to use linked frames, but this departs from Writer use case. You switch to desktop publishing (DTP) where pages are primary objects while Writer is flow-oriented (it allocates dynamically pages to accommodate text). With Writer in “DTP mode”, you must create yourself all pages, insert a text frame covering the whole print area (so that no stray text can be placed on the page) and link the frames from page to page. It can be done if the book is 10 pages long but this is a real pain for 100+ pages.

There is yet another problem if you want to collect a TOC. Entries in the TOC may not be in page order because frames are scanned in creation-time order.


A possible workaround if you require strictly parallel (separate) pages. You can lay out your streams inside a (single) page. To give more width to the streams, orient your page landscape.

Insert a 2-column table, allowing it and its rows to split across pages, one column for original language, the second for the translation.

The “sync points” are mentioned earlier are rows. You can tune the frequency of these “sync point” by the text you put in a cell. However, I recommend you stick to one paragraph. The main reason is to facilitate table splitting. Laying out huge cells (rows) has a considerable impact on performance (all the more on big tables spanning pages and pages). Using smaller cells offers more split/spill-over opportunities.

You can also limit tables to text between headings: you trade a huge table for several smaller (independent) ones which puts less stress on Writer.


With more information on your purpose, I can give better suggestions.

When asking here, always mention OS name, LO version and save format. The latter (.odt vs. docx) is the most important because “comfortable” formatting of sophisticated documents relies on styles which generally are lost when saving to DOCX.

Yes provided your document is methodically styled. Styles are organised according to a hierarchical inheritance tree. Style attributes can be “transparent” (in which case their value is inherited from the ancestor) or explicitly “set” (in which case they override what is inherited from the ancestor). Beware! I used word “set”, but I should have written “touched”. Suppose you select Fancy font to change from inherited Liberation Serif and you change your mind afterwards. If you select again Liberation Serif, you don’t revert to inherited value. You override this inheritance because you explicitly select the font. You must press Reset to Parent button to put all attributes in this screen to “transparent”.

All you have to do is to customise Default Paragraph Style which is the ultimate ancestor of all styles (and for this reason should not be used to format text; the “standard” style for your narrative is Body Text).

Factory configuration contains several intermediate styles which control (override) various branches in the tree. You access these intermediate styles in a simplified form with Tools>Options, LO Writer>Basic Fonts (Western).

A possible workaround if you require strictly parallel (separate) pages. You can lay out your streams inside a (single) page. To give more width to the streams, orient your page landscape.

Insert a 2-column table, allowing it and its rows to split across pages, one column for original language, the second for the translation.

The “sync points” are mentioned earlier are rows. You can tune the frequency of these “sync point” by the text you put in a cell. However, I recommend you stick to one paragraph. The main reason is to facilitate table splitting. Laying out huge cells (rows) has a considerable impact on performance (all the more on big tables spanning pages and pages). Using smaller cells offers more split/spill-over opportunities.

You can also limit tables to text between headings: you trade a huge table for several smaller (independent) ones which puts less stress on Writer.

This sounds like it could do the trick. I will give it a shot.
Limiting tables to text between headings? Does this mean that I just have a different table for every chapter or so?
I mean, the translations were done line by line, sentence by sentence so the texts are not too different in terms of quantity.

Just tried this. The footnotes get distributed in the wrong way, they are on the left for the language which is on the right. If I paste the second language, they are not split. Is there a way of splitting the two footnotes apart while using the table with multiple rows?

D.

If your chapters are required to start on a new (odd?) page, it is certainly wise to have one table per chapter.

I am a bit afraid of “monster tables” due to their impact on performance. However I think the main detrimental factor is the size of text you put in individual cells. Cells are considered “independent” sub-documents and Writer needs to collect all cell contents in a row into memory before deciding how to flow/split this contents. Thus if a row spans several pages, this can be a lot of data to keep simultaneously in memory (for the sake of determining where page break occurs).

If you limit yourself to parallel paragraphs (usually they are on the order of 10-15 lines long, except in obscure philosophy essays) or parallel sentences if they are indeed paragraphs, you should be on the safe side.

Unfortunately no, but you can cheat. Layout won’t be nice but it is worth a try.

Define two paragraph styles for your footnotes. You can keep Footnote for one of the languages and create Footnote (Translated) for the other. Let’s say Footnote is for the left language:

  • set Indent After text (the right indent) to slightly smaller than half page width (e.g. in an A4 sheet whit 2 cm margins, this leaves 17 cm for print area; then set at 8 cm to leave a 1 cm gap)

In the new Footnote (Translated), derived from Footnote:

  • set Indent Before text (the left indent) to slightly larger than half page width (e.g. with the same layout as above, set at 9.5 cm to leave a 1 cm gap with the note number)
  • reset Indent After Text to 0 cm
  • leave (= don’t touch) Indent First Line to -0.6 cm (if you change it in Footnote, it will also change in Footnote (Translated) provided you derived this new style from the other one, thus guaranteeing formatting consistency

Since your notes will alternate between sheet halves, I suggest you modify the note separator length to 100% in the page style so that it extents from margin to margin.


As I said, the result is not very aesthetic. So other schemes are possible, depending on the frequency of notes in the original language vs. the translation. For instance, you could keep full-width for “original” notes and only indent those for the translation, making immediately visible to which language the note applies.